Author Topic: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA  (Read 504 times)

Max Sandell

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 121
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2018, 06:37:54 PM »
Well...  It's an awful problem, thats for sure.  For those who have never been, Cherry Springs is a truly amazing dark sky site.  It makes my New Jersey "dark site" seem like it's terrible!  Most fortunately, though, it seems as though the drillers have been quite cooperative with Pennsylvania star-gazers.  I think this should be a lesson that more flies can be caught with honey than vinegar!

scamcackratge

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 116
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #16 on: January 23, 2018, 12:23:59 AM »
Hi Gary,I for one would like to thank you for all the time you have spent now and in the past trying to protect CSSP.  I think it would be foolish for us to think the burn off will stop anytime soon.  I for one hope the companies that stand to make a huge amount of money drilling and burning these wells will not mind stopping their progress during dark cycles.  My gut tells me otherwise though.  I will be writting to the appropriate officials to have my side heard.  Again thanks Gary, hope to see you at a dark BFSP.

Stanley Edwards

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 132
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #17 on: January 23, 2018, 05:39:56 AM »
"That’s true. However the current projections are for thousands of fracting gas wells to be drilled in the NY/PA border region. The process allows for drilling side wells from existing ones. The burn-off is bad, but so are the tower lights used while drilling – just not as bad as the burning. …..and then there’s the heavy truck traffic for bringing in the water and taking out the brine that goes on 24 hours per day during drilling.There will be no stopping the drilling, not with billions of $$ to be made. We’ll all just have to learn to live with it. "That is one of the most depressing things I've read in a while. Upstate PA was one of the most remote and wild places left on the East Coast... nothing but fields, farms, and forests as far as the eye could see - and a sky as dark as it was meant to be. I guess somebody noticed that this corner of the Earth hadn't yet been destroyed, so now they are hard at work, making up for lost time. Any word on when the super-illuminated Walmarts and overpriced McMansions will be put in place so that any trace of what was there is gone? *sigh*

Steven Morrison

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 108
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #18 on: January 23, 2018, 04:58:11 PM »
Deep breath, everyone.  This isn't the end of the world.  This well just happened to have a flare when people were present at the park.  We hope it doesn't become a constant problem, obviously, but...

...we're talking about a BIG area.  The well in question was very close, about 4 miles, from the park.  There's not too many wells that could be done that close to the park.  Maybe what CSSP needs is a "flare alert" to let observers know when flares are going on.

In the meantime, folks, let's just see how this plays out.  Flares are temporary.  The worst threats are stationary light sources.  A Walmart within 10 miles of the park is very unlikely, as are massive retirement communities and subdivisions.  Look, if I put up with horrible weather in the Northeast / Great Lakes region for decades and it's time for my sunset years, I'm going to spend them in areas that are lot less cryogenic in the wintertime than Potter County, PA.  And if I'm working...I'd be looking for other places to live; Coudersport is very small for a county seat in the Eastern U.S.  There's simply not enough jobs to attract throngs of people to the region.

The worst threat, by far, is that of a state prison.  Put one of THOSE 4 miles away, and good-bye CSSP.

Bottom line--DON'T PANIC.  Yet.

Clear Skies,
Phil

Richard Reed

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 130
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #19 on: January 25, 2018, 11:57:02 PM »
Quote
..... I will be writting to the appropriate officials to have my side heard.....

A friend already wrote to his PA state Senator and the response back was (paraphrasing): 'The state wild lands and dark sky at Cherry Springs are truly great resources. Unfortunately, there is nothing that can be done about the gas drilling since it’s on private land and the impact on light pollution and water resources should subside after the wells are all drilled.'

…..pretty much what I got back from my local gov guy in New York, but he was more sarcastic and less supportive of suppressing the negative environmental impact.

Corey Gibson

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 133
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #20 on: January 31, 2018, 09:41:21 AM »
Isn't burning the gas off a waste of precious natural gas?  Why can't that be stopped?

glyctetabung

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 114
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #21 on: February 02, 2018, 01:14:46 PM »
Quote
Deep breath, everyone.  This isn't the end of the world.

Well, we’ll have to wait and see.

However, the light pollution issue is not just from burning off gas, it’s also from the massive light towers they put up while drilling 24 hrs/day, the convoys of trucks bringing in equipment and huge amounts of water, and taking out the brine – and that goes on 24 hrs/day. There is also vibration and smell involved, plus need to repair roads stressed by the heavy equipment. Air pollution and water supply contamination are less apparent threats, but they could impact Cherry Springs State Park. There are going to be lots of wells drilled in the NY/PA border area. The jobs coming into the area will be well drilling and gas pipeline jobs, and heavy equipment and water truck driving. Of course, after a period of time all of the wells and pipelines will be in and the lights should go out.

Bobby Cruz

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 125
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #22 on: February 03, 2018, 02:50:09 AM »
Quote
Isn't burning the gas off a waste of precious natural gas?  Why can't that be stopped?

It’s apparently a needed part of the gas well drilling process. At this point there's no pipelines and they need to get the gas flowing out of the new well. The sat images of the earth at night show many gas well burn-off lights in South America and other locations.

Justin Lewis

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 124
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #23 on: February 04, 2018, 11:46:19 AM »
Quote
Lets hope that the giant WindZilla turbines do not encroach upon the area with their obnoxious flashing navigational warning beacons.

Obnoxious, yes.  Detrimental to actual astronomical viewing - well - I'll guardedly state - not so much. They put up 50 of the things near me last year.  The two closest are within a 1/2 mile from my house.  Still, I'm not all that fond of them myself.

I've been following the Cherry Springs issue for a while - while it stinks, it should be a transitory thing.  Just remind the gas company that you guys are there - utilities have this habit of putting in 24/7 lighting for their facilities by me.  (Actually the worst bit about the windmills near me turned out to be the substations rather than the windmiles...)

I hope things get worked out.  What a horrible shock for folks expecting a dark sky site.

T

ovhercayvic

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 120
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #24 on: February 08, 2018, 09:43:17 PM »
Am I the only one having a surreal vision of a group of windmills that do nothing but power their own 24/7 spotlight level illumination? Sounds about right... but think how good it is for the environment! Argh!

Joel Cahill

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 116
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #25 on: February 08, 2018, 09:57:45 PM »
If industrial wind turbines were so great the Statue of Liberty would be holding one in her hand like a child's pinwheel.

akbrevecop

  • Active Astronomer
  • ***
  • Posts: 116
  • Activity:
    0%
  • Reputation: +0/-0
    • View Profile
Re: Bad news for Cherry Springs Dark Sky Park in PA
« Reply #26 on: February 09, 2018, 04:31:11 AM »
Wind turbines do not produce dispatchable power, and are very costly for what they produce.  The ultimate solution for the present is more nuclear power plants.